6l80 vs 10l80 transmission 6l80 vs 10l80 transmission

This product is NOT intended to be used on factory OE vehicles such as; Cadillac, Corvette, Camaro Lets talk about some of the concerns and fixes we have been seeing. If the transmission fluid is discolored or has evidence of debris in the fluid, it would be recommended to replace the torque converter and flush the system to complete this repair. The stator shaft support housing comes with these gears as one assembly. Weight 230+ lbs (weight varies depending on application) Engine torque rating increases minimally, but the output torque rating of the transmission jumps up by nearly 220 ft. lbs. Your email address will not be published. Its like wheres Waldo. The taper may exist so that the clutch surface goes flat when the cover is welded together were not sure. Thats pretty much all thats to it. In the TMBX, the damper is on the transmission side of the clutch piston, and in the JMBX, the damper is located on the engine side of the piston. yr=d.getFullYear(); I use this vehicle to tow a 20 ft 10k trailer that I use to carry a 5500lb tractor. Thats more than almost any other GM automatic transmission. We all know that automatic transmission failures can have many root causes. If there are worn valves or faulty inputs or controls, its easy to see how the clutch could start to shudder and quickly fail. With its 2017-2018 heralding, Ford has equipped 3 domestic models with the 10R80 transmission. Did the converter clutch material just wear out, thus allowing the clutch and cover to go metal-on-metal? only) '72-'79, Small Block V8, Gen. To achieve this flip-flopped damper orientation in the JMBX, the profile and shape of the piston is radically different from the TMBX. It looks nearly identical to the 6L90. After programming, perform the Adaptive Learning Drive Cycle and reevaluate the vehicle. 8L80E Always appreciate the great exchanges. It can also be found in the Lincoln Navigator. All Rights Reserved. 6L80E Specs The 6L80 is a robust transmission and can handle a ton of power. The source of the contamination, however, is not readily apparent. But look at the clutch pistons and spring dampers they are markedly different. Double-step (skipping a gear) upshifts results when a longer time is spent in gear. GM has been useless to say the least, and waited me out (now off warranty). full. Thank You.. Jef, Swapping a LS3 and 6 spd trans in , In place of a 454 and a turbo 400 3 spd, I currently have posi rear, Big yolk drive shaft, after the conversion, will i need to mess with the rear gear, or will I be ok for around town and occasional red light duel. The General Motors 6L80-E & 6L90-E transmissions are among the most diverse and capable transmissions of their time; being used in everything from exciting muscle cars to family SUV's. In this Drivetrain 101, we'll analyze all of its most prolific problems, solutions and upgrades. Do you think that I might pick up a few more hundredths if I switch the lock on say when I hit second? Internal hydraulic leakage, hard part failures and contaminated/failed solenoids are all issues that can plague units, some more than others. Accelerate from a stop with light throttle (15%), ensuring that upshifts 1st through 8th occur at engine speeds between 1300-1600 rpm. But tall highway gearing arent the only way that this transmission maximizes efficiency. This creates the situation where the engine drops less rpm from First to Second gear. The HydraMatic can be adapted to the popular Jeep transfer cases, including the: Essentially all factory GM 4wd applications available with an OEM configured 6L80 have adapters and transfer cases that are prohibitively long for a Jeep, and transfer cases whose sizes and gearing fall short of desirable for most Jeep applications. The 6L80 (and similar 6L90) is a six-speed automatic transmission built by General Motors at its Willow Run Transmission plant in Ypsilanti, MI.It was introduced in late 2005, and is very similar in design to the smaller 6L45/6L50, produced at GM Powertrain in Strasbourg, France.It features clutch to clutch shifting, eliminating the one-way clutches used on older transmission designs. The following drivability conditions will be present when this type of DTC is stored. Tenth 0.64 6L80/90 - 8L90 Floor Tap Shifter Kit. check the starter bendix and see if its loose and bouncing off the flywheel. Im thinking 3.73. This idler gear and ball bearing assembly is mounted to the stator shaft support housing. What is most welcome about it is that it is a very durable, functional and impressive transmission assembly and appears to have a terrific prospect with GM and the aftermarket community. Had transmission rebuilt (Pro).My problem is that when it gets around 35, 8L90E Specs, Performance, and Identification, TH400 Transmission Specs, ID, and Common Problems, Mazda 6 P0320: Meaning, Causes, & Diagnosis. Ninth 0.69 The same shift strategy that is used for the upshift may be applied during a downshift. As to length, this transmission is 26-1/4" long. Engine torque estimate: Directly affects shift pressure control, TCC control, and transmission diagnostics. At times the 10-speed transmission may skip gears when the vehicle downshifts to a complete stop. This transmission makes an excellent conversion transmission due to its adaptability into most Jeeps longer than CJ5s. The TCM-2650 is compatible with the GM 6L45/50, 6L80/90 . Autostart / Autostop function disabled (if equipped), Transmission Adaptive Pressure Control and adaptive shift values Frozen, High line pressure (harsh shifts and engagements). The 6L80 features a generously deep first gear for an automatic, making for favorably powerful starts from a standing stop. From the workshop on ongoing projects and more, and where the new images are added afterwards. Indirectly affects shift pressure control. Brake pedal position: Directly affects shift scheduling and TCC scheduling, Air/fuel management adaptive values reset. Related Articles Dana offers Spicer end yokes for Allison Transmissions ATI introduces six-speed Chevy transmission performance package Georend Transmission adds Ford 6R140 transmission pan kit. Comparing that to our old TH-400 combo, wed need 5.40:1 rear gear to equal the overall First Gear ratio in the new Corvette. ! All this is handled with application of planetary ratios. At the current time, the only way to use a GM 6 or 8-speed automatic is to tie it in with a GM engine like the LS3 and use the engine controller to work with transmission. Then, because the six-speed is splitting ratios, the rpm drop between gears is less because TCI has turned this into a five-speed automatic with an overdrive. Mine did it on flat ground only it downshifted four or more gears with a loud bang then jumped back up to tenth with the same bang. 700R4 / 4L60E with PATC close ratio gear set. Application RWD & 4WD / AWD The 10R80 transmission is a 10-speed, rear-wheel-drive transmission that is controlled by a PCM or a TCM. Special tools are often needed when diagnosing transmission problems and overhauling units. The 6L80 was, from the ground up, developed as an electric over hydraulic transmission with microprocessor control. 2024 Mustang Prices Are Out, Dark Horse Is . When its enabled at low speeds the exhaust tone becomes muffled, the AFM valves clatter open and closed, v4 vibration and increased injector noise is nothing but annoying, especially with a convertible. What is your recomendation for towing? Before we get started, lets cover the basics. While working on a 2017-2018 Ford F150/Raptor, 2018 Expedition, Mustang, and Lincoln Navigator equipped with a 10R80 transmission, you may experience erratic TCC operation, or a TCC shudder concern. Like earlier automatics, the 6L80 features one line pressure tap available for testing and diagnostic purposes. all that is needed is a Throttle position signal and Engine RPM. Copyright 2006-2020 GEARS Magazine. A JMBX torque converter rebuilt with a Sonnax forged cover and piston has proven to be a successful recipe for a long-lasting unit, preventing this typical pattern failure. Transmission Pan Bolt Set Chevy 6L80E 6L90E 8L80E 8L90E 10L80E 10L90E 18pcs. Note: The mounting pad is usually a part of the extension housing, but the graphic shows it on the maine case. The 6L80, adapted and ready for a Jeep Dana 300 and the Jeep New Process transfer cases. Diagnosis and correction of a max line pressure condition may become, With Hondas 10-speed front wheel drive transmission (see Figure 1, above) going into its fifth year on the roads, its feasible that one may show up in your shop for service. The overall First gear ratio is deeper at 2.97:1 which means the car builder can leave a taller rear gear ratio in the rear end and still have great First gear acceleration. There are five main inputs the vehicle uses for transmission shift strategy, they are: The Adaptive Learning Drive Cycle must be performed after any of the following procedures are performed: Perform the adaptive learning drive cycle on a level road surface as follows: After the final step, place the vehicle in park and cycle the ignition key off. The question is will the 10L80 be as strong as the 10L90? Thx The 6L80 is a robust transmission and can handle a ton of power. When diagnosing this unit, it is very important to realize that the failure management programs built into the powertrain system may be a direct reflection of the customers drivability complaint. Powerglide (bellhousing pattern - Chevrolet, Fit-all), TH350 (bellhousing pattern - Chevrolet, BOP, Fit-all), TH400 (bellhousing pattern - Chevrolet, BOP), TH200-4R (bellhousing pattern - BOP, Fit-all), TH700-R4 /4L60 (bellhousing pattern - Chevrolet). Unlike previous shift solenoids, they are mechanical in nature in that no transmission fluid passes through them (Figure 2). Shift the transmission to Neutral. Will it be like the 5th gen's where the ss got the 6L80 and the more powerful ZL1 got the 6L90? Much akin to the GM 10L80-E & 10L90-E transmissions is the 10R80 transmission's oil pump. Other common 6L80E transmission problems include: After a prolonged drive time, DTC P0752 Pressure Control Solenoid A Stuck On. TH400, TH200-4R, TH700-R4, 4L60, 4L60E (without converter), 6L80E Fluid capacity with 258 mm converter, 6L80E Fluid capacity with 300 mm converter, 6L90E Fluid capacity with 300 mm converter. What all needs to be done to change it from four-wheel-drive to 2 Wheel Dr? While converter failures are not uncommon with other transmission families, you are thinking that this is really becoming a pattern for the 6L80, 6L90. 3) 6L80E with fixed output flange is about 2 1/2" shorter than 4L60E and about 3 1/2" shorter than 200-4R. GM was still using their trustworthy 4L80E transmissions for heavier duty use, which was essentially a 1960's technologyTH400with added 1990's overdrive and electronic controls. Subscribe Now Larry Callahan Founder/Administrator of Pro-Touring.com, G-Machines.com and HostMyJunk.com To advertise on Pro-Touring.com click here For now, the bulk of reported cases are related to diesel vehicles. Internally they are very different but at least with the 8l90 you do not need to completely disassemble the transmission to convert to 4wd from 2wd. 97 it's a, I have a 2007 h3 hummer base model. And you are correct the converters in these units are experiencing a high percentage of failure and are more problematic than normal. The way the power is applied is different than the 4L80E / TH-400. Grade braking and clutch line pressure (for greater holding power) are additionally great features that are activated by Tow / Haul mode on the truck platforms. Do you know does the aftermarket have a fix? Transmission Report: 6L80, 6L90 Transmission Tech Advisory: Consider an Updated Converter in Your Next Rebuild. Gm hydro 10 speed. At times the 10-speed transmission may skip gears when the vehicle starts from a complete stop. Sometimes, finding the cause of a complaint isnt as straightforward as one would expect; sometimes, these causes can be very elusive. A horsepower revolution spawned by GM's increasingly powerful Gen. III+ V8 engines and their aggressive platforms such as the Cadillac STSV, XLRV, various trucks and SUV's and the venerable Corvette. Power Pack Only, for Power Hub | 195756-7754. The traditional small-block six-bolt bellhousing pattern is the best and easiest way to identify a 4L60E style transmission if you find one at the swap meet for sale. To be honest, we arent 100% sure of the real reason for JMBX cover and piston failure, but we do have a theory. In 2018 and later models with the transmission warmer mounted to the transmission, there can be a concern with coolant leaking under the vehicle. A 2005 Ford F350 with the 6.0 liter diesel engine and 5R110W transmission has set a P0753 Pressure Control Solenoid A - Electrical Fault code and a P2700 Transmission Friction Element A - Apply Time Out Of Range code. So its no wonder that the new cars accelerate so welltheyve got a ridiculously deep overall First gear ratio and reduced rpm drops between the gear changes. The solenoids can be replaced separately, but only with the same type of solenoid. Ive heard a little about thisdid they add two more gears to the transmission? Use it to verify the vehicle has a M30 4L60ENow, if the transmission is out of the vehicle (or if you dont trust a sticker), the 6L80E has an 18 bolt case. Then, of course, Sixth gear is still 0.75:1 overdrive. The 10L80 moniker is decoded. Genuine ICT Billet - Bolts Made in USA!!!! But I was su unhappy with it I sold a bunch of parts and began changing the built. The 6L80 would have big shoes to fill, with legendary predecessors like the TH400, 4L80E and 4L60E transmissions. 80 series is rated for 80 Newton's, 90 series is rated for 90 Newton's. TIPM Problems! I have a 700 R4 trani with a dash mounted after market switch to engage or disengage my lock up.The trani has a 2500 stall & is behind a old school 383 stroker engine with 388 hp at the motor with a 3.73 Rr gear. I also have a 2wd 2006 Trailblazer SS with a forged 416ci stroked LS3 which makes around 600 hp or so with a Yank SS3600 stall converter. I work on other peoples vehicles for a living. Aisin AY6 6-speed longitudinal manual made by Aisin. vehicle weights. Reproduction in whole or in part without permission is prohibited. Now, the high-speed CAN network allows a high rate of data sharing between the units to achieve a collaboration between both engine and transmission functions. The transmission is automatically shifted featuring performance algorithms to minimize upshifts during closed throttle driving to prevent unnecessary shifting. Upon a test drive and a scan, code P0741 is noted and the percentage of TCC slip shows to be way out of range. The 10R80 doesn't have a traditional "front" pump. None of the above categories describe me. Made of billet aluminum with included swivel -6 AN fittings with 3/8" barbs. After a prolonged drive time, DTC P0752 Pressure Control Solenoid A - Stuck On and P0973 Pressure Control Solenoid A - Circuit Low also set. The 6L80 began manufacture in 2005 for release in 2006 model year GM vehicles, persisting until at least 2016 in both 6L80 and 6L90 versions. Note, all models will have a warmer. If thats the case, the valve body will have to be replaced to correct these concerns. Inspect the warmer for damage and related lines for leaks (Figure 4). Allows easy highway cruising, seamless downshifts, Transbrake and 2nd gear (2.34) leave options through multiple templates tuned independently of the engine management system! Specifications The 6L80 denotes that the transmission is a 6-Speed, Longitudinally mounted, and for 8000 lbs. We Specialize In: GM LS Conversions Engine & Trans Combo Kits Unique Ready to Run Engines Have a question? Convert your american classic car with more modern technology. The 6L90 has a beefier set of gears and many internal upgrades. if the car would be faster with the 6 speed auto vs the 10 speed auto. The 6L80 Hydra-Matic transmission is a 6 speed automatic transmission manufactured by General Motors. Also fits '05-'06 Pontiac GTO (differential side). The TMBX and the JMBX have similar covers and use the same woven carbon friction material, yet the JMBX fails catastrophically at a very high rate and the TMBX cover rarely fails. It was created to help GM meet ever more demanding CAFE regulations on their vehicles. Members The band number is printed on the solenoids in the location shown and will be a 1, 2, 3, 4, or 5 (Figure 3). By Wayne Colonna. Im with you on AFM is crap. Brake very gently to a complete stop and hold the foot brake for five (5) seconds. The complaint A 2005 Ford F350 with the 6.0 liter diesel engine and 5R110W transmission has set a P0753 Pressure Control Solenoid A Electrical Fault code and a P2700 Transmission Friction Element A Apply Time Out Of Range code. The 6L80 is a modular transmission, featuring removable bellhousings and tailhousings for interchangeability with the GM 90 Degree engines and other potential engines in the future. Before answering that question, its worth noting the role that Sonnax plays in the converter rebuilding business. The new 2019 Camaro gets the a10 but, Its not the a10 (10L90) from the ZL1. So you would need to begin with a 2008 or newer Express to be able to convert from a 4L80 to a 6L80 / 6L90. Shift stabilization is achieved through these and similar strategies. If we change to the latest GM 10-speed automatic it has a 4.70:1 First gear and is factory matched with a 2.85:1 rear gear. Click Here to Email our Sales & Tech Staff 888-748-4655 Local: 330-965-7146 International: 001-330-652-5855 Mon-Fri 8am-5pm EST Sat-Sun: Closed The General Motors Hydra-Matic 10-speed 10L80 automatic transmissions is a heavy duty (high performance) variant of the Hydra-Matic 10LXX transmission family. A P59 PCM controlled both the engine and the transmission. LT). How is this different from the GM 6L80E transmission that is used in the Corvette or in the newer GM trucks? Im not tuned ( not yet anyway), however, if I knew then what I know today, I probably would have went for the M6. Hi Jeff, I have a 2016 Silverado with the 5.3 and the 8 speed transmission. Related Articles ATI introduces new e-clutch hub for ZF8HP51 Sonnax adds new stator support bushing for Ford 6F35 Alto adds to intermediate clutch PowerPack line for GM transmissions According to Sonnax, the heavy OE LFS, GFX announced a new pump component for GM Powerglide models, covering several vintage model years: 1950 through 1973. Thank you. or Best Offer . should check for clearance. Note, some customers may complain of a converter type whine noise coming from the transmission. When other diagnostic trouble codes are present, there can be different, specific drivability concerns caused by the failure management program. Be aware of your output shaft version before proceeding with any adaptation. Stock capacity . I'd be modding it to a FBO car with cam and converter eventually. The bottom line: The very thin (.020") woven carbon friction material cant survive the way the JMBX piston applies. As a result, it became a popular choice despite sharing most of its internal components with its predecessor, the 700R4. All I can find is that it is sealed from the rear and just needs a new tail housing but some say its got to be completely rebuilt from the inside. That is RIDICULOUS, Cheryl. Shop Finder Related Articles Are you ready to rock in 2023? This is a completely new and different transmission compared to the 4L80E. However, at light pedal or road load, single-step upshifts will occur. Starting with the 2017 Ford F-150, the 10R80 transmission was an option. They all look really similar, so make sure that you bother to count the pan gasket bolts, especially if you have an untrained eye. Drive the vehicle until the engine and transmission reach normal operating temperature. The 6L80 / 6L90 uses three-way solenoids and variable bleed solenoids for improved shift quality. None of the clutch packs can engage, and there is no fail-safe operation. Your cooperation with this program is greatly appreciated. The button for Tap control is on the top of the shifter, making it easy to use in both left and right hand drive vehicles. Then to create a new Second gear, the overdrive is engaged 2.97 x 0.75 = 2.23:1. 10R80 transmission swap? Nov 26 . The overall First gear ratio is 2.48 x 4.10 = 10.17:1. Fluid pressure is maintained by an off-axis main pump that can vary the displacement depending on the load.